How One Freelancer Earns Over $300k Per Year Copywriting On Fiverr | With Alexandra Fasulo

Brian: [00:00:00] Welcome to the six-figure creative podcast. I'm your host Brian Hood, and I'm here with my big bald beautiful

[00:00:05] mustached cohost Christopher J. Graham, Chris. Hey dude.

[00:00:09] Chris: [00:00:09] I'm fantastic, man. How

[00:00:11]Brian: [00:00:11] I'm doing pretty excellent just because we've done so many podcasts this week, and we're finally getting six figure creative out, launched to the world after such a long time off for various reasons.

[00:00:20] And so, yeah, my, my

[00:00:21] spirits are up my dude. You know, what about you? You got, you got anything

[00:00:24] uh, particularly.

[00:00:26]Chris: [00:00:26] I'm great. I've been working out every day lately in the gym and that's So

[00:00:30]Brian: [00:00:30] I'm going to have to change the intro. So like, if anyone's listening for a while, you know, I always say big ball, beautiful. I just added the mustache thing because you have a mustache now, which took me off guard. And I tried not to laugh at you the first time I saw it, but, you know, whatever, but that's part of the intro now.

[00:00:44] But if you stop being big, I've got to take that out as well. So keep working. And were replaced big with something else, maybe broad shoulder. I don't it's always fun when we have guests on the podcast. Now we're doing more and more interviews. I felt more and more awkward doing any sort of long-term banter, which is great for our audience, because that means we actually get into the episode faster than normal.

[00:01:00] So we're going to do that today because we have an awesome guest on the show today. Known as, and I don't know if you go by this officially Alex known as the freelance fiver millionaire, Alex Fasulo she's on the podcast with us today and she's what I would consider an expert on all things Fiverr she has made.

[00:01:15] These are public numbers, so I'm not being like Snoopy. These are out there. If you want me to cut these out, I can cut these out.

[00:01:19] Okay.

[00:01:20]2017, starting out in offering freelance copywriting made $63,000. The first year, second year, 20 18, 270 $3,000. My God, what a jump third year, 2019 $350,000. And then 2020 last year, the year that the world kind of fell apart.

[00:01:35]Still made $378,000. She's been featured on Fiverr's blog. Of course. Why wouldn't they I'm surprised she's not the spokesperson of Fiverr she's been featured on CNBC Forbes, business, insider Yahoo. Now I feel completely inadequate and inequipped to, to interview someone who's been featured in all these areas, but this is Alex facil.

[00:01:53] Thank you so much for coming on the podcast.

[00:01:55]Alex: [00:01:55] Thank you, Brian. That was a lovely introduction. you don't have to cut those numbers.

[00:02:04]Brian: [00:02:04] 300 like 78 bucks a month or something like that. I did my research. so Alex, there's like, there's so much, I want to discuss with you on this episode. And we have so little time in the grand scheme of life, in how many years we have ahead of us in our lives. So in this interview, I would like to cover a few things, but first I want to talk about something that I want you to change my mind on.

[00:02:22] And that is something that I've publicly been. I've always been against Fiverr as an Enneagram eight, if you know anything about Enneagram Integram eights con, they crave control over their th the things in their life. And. Takes that control away from me. And I've always been scared to put my business on another platform, whether I'm depending on that.

[00:02:40] So we don't have to dispel that myth or that, that argument right now. I'm hoping you change your mind through this because the numbers don't lie that you, you, you don't get to almost 400 K a year on a platform and say it sucks. Like obviously it is working for you. So I'm, I just want to set the stage for our listeners right now, especially for those who are like five or six.

[00:02:57] I'd never used five or wa I mean, Alex has got the proof here, so let's, let's dive into this. I want to talk about with you. A question before I'd even get to the beginnings of the Fiverr and how you make a Korean Fiverr. This stuff you've talked about a million times forever.

[00:03:07]I want to ask you if you were starting over today as a freelance writer, would you start on Fiverr

[00:03:13]Alex: [00:03:13] Yes, I would, because I, still think it's the best place for beginners. I don't necessarily advocate it being a place where you should have your business 5, 6, 7 years into the game. I think you should. Ultimately try to get off of it, but I still think it's the best place to kind of dive in head first and get used to different things like customer service, sales pricing, working with clients, you know, all of those things that you're going to have to learn, no matter how you do it. I think Fiverr is still the best way to get that experience quickly. And that's everyone who messages me, it's all about how fast can I make, you know, X amount of dollars. So I would still advocate that it'd be a place that you jump on in the beginning. But I wouldn't advocate staying with it as long as I have.

[00:03:56]Because you hit a point where it's not worth the 20% that they take, but you Yeah that point.

[00:04:03]Brian: [00:04:03] I, I completely understand that cause

[00:04:05]you have to pay income tax too, and it's already hard enough pill to swallow paying income tax every year when you have to pay base. Cause to income tax is one to five or one of the U S government Really hard, really fast and really old, really fast.

[00:04:15]Chris: [00:04:15] Well, you said something really cool. And one of the videos I watched about you, Alex, where you talked about. You know how miserable that you were at your job in New York and that when you first started doing, I think it was PR releases for $15 a pop on Fiverr, and that you talked about what it was like to suddenly have no strangers sending you money.

[00:04:36]And this idea that, oh my gosh, there's probably more of them out there. Could I charge them more? And that really spoke to me because that was my experience with my business. The first time a stranger sent me money, it was this like, whoa, what world am I living in? This is crazy. is that what you're talking about?

[00:04:52] Why, why you think Fiverr is so good for people to start with? It gets them that sort of initial hit.

[00:04:58]Alex: [00:04:58] I think of course, so that five or steps in as your marketing department, so many people I know who jump in, don't know the thing about marketing themselves or their services. They have no social media presence. They have no website, they have nothing. And with five are you set up your profile and it essentially throws you into its marketplace.

[00:05:16] So you don't have to worry about the marketing element you, you do in the sense that the branding of your profile needs to be good. And that's actually the biggest thing that takes. People down is not understanding branding and marketing. But five are kind of cuts out needing to have a website, you know, know how to post on Instagram about your services or LinkedIn.

[00:05:34] It kind of removes all of that. Cause I think it can be very overwhelming at first to know everything you need to know. So for me, when I first started doing it, I wasn't posting, you know, people get confused because they see my social media. Now, obviously it's blown up because I post a lot of. But I didn't for the first three or four years, you know, I was making six figures on there with no personal website, no Instagram presence, nothing.

[00:05:56] And I think that's why I recommend that people get on there because

[00:06:00] the marketing chat is a whole different game. You know, that most of these people do Yeah that

[00:06:07] Brian: [00:06:07] that's the great point. That's the strength I see in, on platforms like Fiverr and that's the appeal that has for, I think anyone who's interested in that Audio industry called sound better. And there's a couple of other ones, air gigs, and a few others in the audio specific world.

[00:06:18] And then there are niche ones for other kinds of fields like design and there's ones for a videography and Fiverrs, kind of the catch all for pretty much all freelancers. And there's a few others out there, but we're not going to get into this. That's not the discussion today. So I w I would like to kind of start at the beginning.

[00:06:32] So you made $63,000 your first year, that was 2017. The first year you got on there as a freelancer or no.

[00:06:37] Alex: [00:06:37] No. I actually got on there in 2015 and I probably made like a thousand bucks that year, So I didn't do it seriously. And then 2016 was the year I really dove in and I think I made exactly what I would have made at the job. I stayed, which was like 36 K and then 2017. It was 63, 68, whatever it is. your as

[00:06:59]Brian: [00:06:59] you mentioned how important it is to set up profile you're getting started on Fiverr. And I think that's one of your, one of your unfair advantages as a, as a writer is it's all copywriting. You have to write like a great profile. Is there anything that you can share with people? If they're trying to start on.

[00:07:16]And then want that initial traction and they don't want to have to wait three years to crack 60 K on Fiverr, which, which by the way, that may be how long it takes. And there's no way around that, but I'm just, I'd love to know some, some general things that you see, people get wrong when sitting up the profile that turns.

[00:07:29]Alex: [00:07:29] yeah, I think actually the biggest thing is the imagery that people really just don't understand. Like you need to have crisp, clear images of your face, smiling eye contact. It

[00:07:41] needs to be professionally shot. A selfie on your phone that mixed yeah. With the writing on the profile can do you in, but I mean, if you want, I give people all the time, you can message a Fiverr writer, have them write for you.

[00:07:54] If you want to pay for it.

[00:07:55] you can right. Edit it. I mean, it's, there's no rules with any of this stuff. So I always say people really want to make it work. I think they can figure out how to make it work, even if they're not the most excellent writer. And for me, when I set up my profile, I looked up. Three to five other people who were already established and copywriting.

[00:08:12] When I joined and I studied exactly how they worded, what they worded, I did my homework, you know, that's all it is. And if you're willing to make this work, there's already everything you need is on there for you to go research. It's just, are you Yeah is

[00:08:27]Brian: [00:08:27] So this something called modeling. We see this in a lot of other industries where you look to someone who's successful and you look to them for what is working instead of trying to invent it from scratch and figure out like through Trial and error and hellfire and brimstone like figuring out what the hell is going to actually work in my business and utterly failed trying.

[00:08:45] You can just look to someone who's successful and say, this is what they're doing. I will start. And then I'll figure it out what works and what doesn't work, and you have much better chance of success. And that's pretty much any industry now that obviously don't just steal the copy of somebody's website, but use it as inspiration to know what sort of style, what sort of things you're writing about what sort of structure they're using on that.

[00:09:03] So, it took you a few years to get traction on Fiverr, and it seems like between 2017 and 2018 things just pop 63 K to 273 K and one year.

[00:09:15] Chris: [00:09:15] What

[00:09:16] Brian: [00:09:16] What the hell? What the hell Alex?

[00:09:19] Alex: [00:09:19] Yeah, it was Fiverr pro which is many people who follow me. I've gone over that with them. We're basically five or launched this new program which is the top 1% of the platform, you know, handpicked talent, it all an effort for them to rebrand as a more quality, you know, marketplace than it was previously, regardless.

[00:09:38]So by joining Fiverr pro, they want you to charge a lot more for your services, you know, the pricing psychology there. So yeah, I went from charging like 20, $25 to a hundred, $100 for the same service that I was offering just a month prior. And it actually launched in 2017, but it didn't really, they didn't really, launch it fully until January, 2018, which then explains yeah, the huge.

[00:10:02]Jump in income. And a lot of people who follow me, they're like, oh, she's outsourcing issue as a team now. Yes, I do have a team now, but I will say 2018. That was all made. So for everyone who's like, oh, it's impossible to make that alone. No, it not,

[00:10:16]Brian: [00:10:16] no, is thing, there is just being on the premium side of pricing, how much that can affect your income. People struggle so much to raise their rates amongst every creative field. We, as creatives are so hesitant to raise our pricing and it's because we just, I'm not going to speak for everyone here, but I know, I know the people that I talk to and see, and honestly, myself earlier in my career, It was a self-worth issue.

[00:10:41] It was like, I don't feel like I'm worth what I'm charging already. Why would I raise my rates? And so, you know, if you would not have raised your rates, that income would have not been anywhere close to that and you would have worked just as much. So let's, let's, let's tackle some things here that you brought up that I want to talk about.

[00:10:56] You talked about the team and we'll get there for sure. think having a team, I think everyone should have a team or at least some people that are outsourcing work

[00:11:02] to at any level, because it takes so much of the tedious crap away that you shouldn't be

[00:11:06] doing as a creative anyways. But we'll, we're going to table this, just that part of discussion for a second.

[00:11:10] Let's talk about how things likely, and I'm not, I'm just speculating here. Likely started to fall apart in 2018, making 273 K getting as many projects as you did, were things slipping through the cracks. Like what,

[00:11:20] what sort of operational challenges.

[00:11:23]Were brought with that sort of jump in income, if anything, and I'm not, I'm just, again, I don't want a project here, but usually I would not see an income jump like that without somebody having some struggles with systems or structure or

[00:11:33] Alex: [00:11:33] No. was honestly just the same amount of work that I had been doing the year before. It just happened to be for a hundred dollars instead of 25. So why was I working 10, 12 hour days for sure. But I think the biggest struggles of all actually came in 2018 when Sam BC covered it for the first time. And more so like the social repercussions and the hate and everything that starts.

[00:11:55]For me, that was the first time that I had experienced it. And I kind of look back on that being almost regretting in a way that I had let CNBC cover the story. Cause I, it was hard, the reception from so many people in my life that are no longer in my life because they didn't like that article very much.

[00:12:12] And you know, 25 old meet and understand how these adults, you know, why I thought they'd be excited for me or whatever. And that's when I got a crash course, I think into uh, humans and human nature. Just because you're 40 or 50 doesn't mean you're any more grown up than a 25 year old. And that was the hardest part of it.

[00:12:30]the backlash, and it was, it felt very lonely for the first time where I was like, what, what's the matter with what I'm doing? Why, why are you upset by

[00:12:38] question that

[00:12:39]Chris: [00:12:39] that a on Why do you think they were upset about.

[00:12:43]Alex: [00:12:43] I mean the first article CNBC, it said how this 25 year old made 150 K in six months. So I learned that money upsets people because I don't care about it. Which people would say like, oh, she cares so much about it. No, I could care less about it. I'm like, whatever. I hand out my money all the time who cares.

[00:13:01] And I realized that other people care tremendously about me. it's like their religion. And I think the shocking nature of that title, people didn't like that maybe they felt, you know, inadequate that I'm making more money than they are. I don't know what I mean. I see all the time people make more money than me.

[00:13:18] I think it's great. I don't know why people care about it, but they sh they do. I

[00:13:25] Brian: [00:13:25] learned that, you

[00:13:26]And I've never seen that to not be true. So haters are gonna always be there. And so. I've seen someone have some high level of success that they're public about their hairs attached to it, no matter what, skeptics, haters, people who are calling you a complete scam, artists, people who calling you a fraud, people who were calling you money hungry or whatever.

[00:13:44] Like, I just, I've gotten all these things myself to the point where like, especially, oh my God, if you ever run Facebook ads, don't ever look at the comments ever, ever, ever, Alex, like I'm telling you right. I know you're getting into like the education world.

[00:13:55] run Facebook ads, hire an assistant to go through all the comments for you and manage them because that'll suck your soul away real quick.

[00:14:01] So I'm just letting you know, like, It's always out there. It's never going to go away and that's just the way humans are. And it sucks. We talked about this on a, on another episode where like the crab

[00:14:09] in a bucket thing is the first time I

[00:14:10] ever heard

[00:14:10] this. So it's just like I guess if you've put a bunch of crabs in a bucket and one tries to climb out, the other crabs

[00:14:15] will literally pull it back in.

[00:14:17] You're like, you're not going to get out of this

[00:14:18] thing. So I love that analogy and it's, it's probably similar to what you experienced. I call it in my background, the Alabama minds.

[00:14:25]And yes, I'm casting shade in my home

[00:14:27] state where it's just like, I don't want anything more. I'm happy with what I have and I don't need to change or grow or adapt.

[00:14:32] And if you're trying to do anything interesting

[00:14:34] or special, no, stop it.

[00:14:36]Alex: [00:14:36] I got a lot of that from my hometown as well. A lot of actually the

[00:14:40] worst hate online is started by people from my high school who feed other, the

[00:14:47]Chris: [00:14:47] the masses

[00:14:49] Alex: [00:14:49] Yeah. Some of the worst stuff that happens is fed by about eight boys from my graduating high

[00:14:57] is

[00:14:57] Chris: [00:14:57] school Alex. That the worst

[00:15:01] Brian: [00:15:01] I don't want to speculate, but I would they're not doing anything interesting with their lives, but you know what? I don't want to.

[00:15:06]Alex: [00:15:06] busy know, I don't I don't.

[00:15:08] Brian: [00:15:08] They're not, they're not that That's

[00:15:10] think

[00:15:10] way of saying it.

[00:15:11] Alex: [00:15:11] Yeah. Yeah. I'll leave it at that. But that's one of the reasons I moved, you know, I actually didn't feel safe in my hometown this

[00:15:19] Brian: [00:15:19] yeah, I

[00:15:20] to talk about stuff because it's it's not a

[00:15:22] fun thing to talk about, but it is important for people to understand. If you're trying to, if you're trying to do something

[00:15:28]an alternative career path. You're not going the traditional socially accepted route to.

[00:15:33]Quote unquote success or stability. Really the stability is a

[00:15:36] big thing that

[00:15:36] people go after more than anything,

[00:15:37] which is the wrong business. If he wants to build

[00:15:39] it, or certainty,

[00:15:41] I'd say stability can be achieved. Certainty is absolutely

[00:15:43] not guaranteed, but if you're going off the path, that's where people are gonna try to pull

[00:15:47] you back or call you stupid or call you names or be jealous.

[00:15:50] Like that's really the thing there. So, you know, I just, I hate, I hate to

[00:15:54] say it, but it is what it is. So all, all we can do is put her, put our heads down, keep moving forward, doing what we're doing ignore the haters.

[00:16:01] That's all I've ever done. It doesn't make it any

[00:16:03] easier to accept, but let's shift gears a little bit here and talk about some of these later years, you, you started to build a team out, which I think

[00:16:10] is one of the best things we can do. I mean, especially once you hit the six figure mark, and, and before, if you can to start taking some of these things off your plate. So what was, what was like the

[00:16:17] first person you got on your team

[00:16:19] to take stuff off your.

[00:16:20]Alex: [00:16:20] I never named any of them, you know, cause they, they didn't sign up to be named, but, one guy I've been writing with since 2019. Uh, Was the first person that I brought in um, because I did all of 2018 alone and I was like, this is amazing. This money is insane. Uh, But this is not sustainable working 12 hours a day writing every day, I'm going to have some problems from this.

[00:16:43] So naturally, why shouldn't I expand, you know, a business like any other person, any other man would in this case. And in 2019, I I brought him, it was just me and him till 2020, even I've been slow with all of it. And then, you know, 2020 is when my brand started to take off. So until 2020, nobody really followed me on social media.

[00:17:04]I, I was still, you know, flying under the radar with it. I had some haters online. I was, you know, low profile. And then 2020 was when I started posting about what I do on Tik TOK. Uh, Not knowing it would blow up of course. But it did. And so kind of the start of my. Media influencer brand started last year, which is then when I brought on I'm like a video editor, You know, a podcast guy now edits my podcast for me. and then I started to build out from really

[00:17:33]Brian: [00:17:33] so the first thing you did, you just hired somebody. Some of the work off your

[00:17:37] plate. And that, that starts to venture into what would call like the agency business model territory, where you're, you're the business owner and you're hiring your team to actually fulfill the work for you, which is the way to do it.

[00:17:48] That's the only way to scale as a freelancer. If we're trying to build businesses that are going beyond

[00:17:53]a hundred thousand, a couple hundred thousand few hundred thousand dollars, you have two models. One is you're going to. To the top of the top and charge 50, a hundred thousand dollars per project, and B be solo would be, make a lot of money.

[00:18:05] It's fine, but it's really hard to get there alone. Or you go to the other side where you're charging industry standard rates for things, and you're building a team to fulfill that work for you. And you're profiting off of that team. That's the agency model. So it seems like you've kind of ventured to that route, but you also had this other opportunity

[00:18:19] kind of pop up along the way with all of this business, publicity, which by the way, do you have a publicist or do you just do this on your own?

[00:18:25]Alex: [00:18:25] I do not have a publicist, but I definitely need one because. Being massacred online right now. And I'm sure you guys have Googled me. My Google reputation is just trashed I couldn't like

[00:18:39] Brian: [00:18:39] I read all of them. I read every single one of them and find a single, every single one of them. I'm just like,

[00:18:43] oh my God, are you serious?

[00:18:45]It's like, to me, it's always, it's the bitter neck

[00:18:47] beard, like sitting in a basement, sweating, writing this

[00:18:49] article about like these

[00:18:50] Alex: [00:18:50] I.

[00:18:51] Brian: [00:18:51] that just don't, they don't add up the tinfoil hat.

[00:18:53] Like, yeah, I, get those and I, and I've seen those, my, for my own stuff. Thankfully, none of those really rank anywhere for me, but

[00:18:58] it sucks to have like some of those rank where they are, but.

[00:19:01] Alex: [00:19:01] Yeah. know, I'm, I'm not a PR specialist, but I know, a fair amount of it and SEO And everything And you know, the, the one article that's out there ranks higher than my CNBC thing, which went viral on apple news. And I've had some people look into some black market marketing that's been put behind that article.

[00:19:19] So someone with a lot of money has it out for me. And they boosted that article. I'm trying to figure out who it was. Cause I can't just, you know, I just

[00:19:32] Brian: [00:19:32] The twist is it's somebody who went to high school with, and they like you you looked at them wrong in high school and they just can't give it up. And so they're Yeah.

[00:19:39]Alex: [00:19:39] thing is they don't have any money to put behind. And so somebody, somebody somewhere higher up is, I don't know what's going on to be continued. Hopefully I'll it out, but.

[00:19:49]Chris: [00:19:49] figure conversation to me as we're talking Alex, I'm, I'm astounded at what a badass you are. You, you are killing it. And I think I want to live in a world where young women are taking these old stupid

[00:20:07] white guys to school. That's great. But it also makes me. wonder what is this path that you're on and this is a question I ask everybody that I'm coaching. What does it look like three years from now? If all your dreams come true.

[00:20:21]Alex: [00:20:21] know, when people ask me that I can't really answer it because I'm not somebody, I just kind of embrace opportunities as they come.

[00:20:28] So. I have no idea what will come my way three years from now, but I embrace all of it. I'm getting close right now to potentially writing a book or having a book deal of some kind.

[00:20:38] So that's on my that's my next big thing that has come my way. I didn't even see, you know, it kind of came to me. It's kind of, whatever comes my way. I just embrace it And, I love doing new things. I love being out of my comfort zone. It's fun. It's weird. And I'm weird. So if somebody came forward and you know, had me, do something totally different from what I'm doing now. I'd probably say, Yes, I get bored with stuff easy.

[00:21:00] You know, I mean, classic entrepreneur, I like to do a bunch of things. So I cannot really say my dreams, I guess I would love to do 20 different things in my life. That's my dream

[00:21:10]Brian: [00:21:10] I'm same way. And I, and I know we'll talk about this more and more on the six-figure creative podcast on branching, out to other areas, diversifying your income being a serial entrepreneur like myself, like you just, I couldn't tell you three years ago that I'd be doing what I'm doing today.

[00:21:24] I can't tell you I'm gonna do three years from now, but I know that I can spot opportunities when they come and I'm going to take those opportunities and I'm gonna run with them as far as I can run with them, at least until I get boarder or. Outsource it to somebody else to take

[00:21:34] on and run for me. But I want to talk about now a little bit kind of back to the freelancing discussion here.

[00:21:39] Cause that's the majority of our listeners are

[00:21:40] freelancers. Do you have any sort of

[00:21:42] structure or time management stuff that you do to manage everything that you have going on? Because that's one area that I think I struggle with. A lot of people struggle with

[00:21:49] is

[00:21:49] actually putting it all in there without dropping them.

[00:21:52]Alex: [00:21:52] Yeah, I mean, I follow kind of the same structure schedule every day. I've always been one of those weird people though, where I've never had I just like, remember it in my head. I know that's not

[00:22:03] Brian: [00:22:03] a calendar

[00:22:04] Alex: [00:22:04] Um, but I, I mean, I follow the same structure kind of every day I get up early and I immediately check my emails to make sure if there's any problem, like I'm addressing it very

[00:22:14] early in the morning And I'm not, you know, oh, I'm surprised by this at 3:00 PM.

[00:22:19]Uh, So yeah, I wake up early do yeah. Generally, and I work out for a little go for a walk And then buy a

[00:22:25] you know, I check my Fiverr messages, make sure everyone's okay on there and no one's flipping out.

[00:22:29] And then I it's just kind of that similar structure every day, no matter if I'm traveling or what I get my writing done in the morning.

[00:22:35] So like after this I'll probably go back to getting all of my like outstanding writing done for the day. And then by the afternoon, I kind of will segue into more of like creative Tech-Talk realm things. about a podcast habits

[00:22:49] Brian: [00:22:49] talk about, we talk lot on this and routines, and that's, it's a similar way that I run my businesses

[00:22:55] is I always have to structure things in chunks like, that, where I have a routine where I'm doing a

[00:23:00] similar type of thing or the right type of thing. I know that my brain works on creative tasks

[00:23:04] better in the morning.

[00:23:05] And in the afternoon I do more administrative more,

[00:23:08]left-brained less creative, more like linear type tasks in the afternoon, generally, unless I'm,

[00:23:14] unless I'm stretched thin in some way, shape or form. And I just have

[00:23:16] to perform like we do podcasts in the afternoon all the time, and I consider that kind of a creative task. The reason I'm asking though is

[00:23:20] because you, you just don't get to the income level. You have. The rates that you're charging, which are, relatively low in the grand scheme of copywriting. I think at least, I don't know where your rates are. Right. The second I didn't, I should have checked, but I didn't, but without having some good structure and systems in place, and I know you have a bit of a team now, I'm sure they're handling like messages and stuff for you because on Fiverr, one of the biggest things that I've noticed is quick reply times because any site like that, the site wants you to get back as fast as possible.

[00:23:45] And honestly, the people expect almost an instant reply when they send a message out. Yeah. Is there anything like that we're missing out as far as like your, your secret sauce for running a successful Fiverr account, other than like fast replies doing great work, like anything.

[00:23:59]Alex: [00:23:59] I don't even respond that quickly on there anymore. Cause I'm doing so many other things and I'm not as enamored with it as I used to be. Cause I get bored. I mean, On five or my reputation proceeds me. Right. So people will just end up booking me they know me at this point. So I'm almost in A like place where I don't even have to technically message people back right away.

[00:24:20] But you know, a lot of people aren't where I am on there. Of course. I mean the

[00:24:23] come up on five or yeah, it's all about. Being attentive, responding right away. You know, if a client's flipping out holding their hand, it's all about like making the client feel like they're your only client of the day.

[00:24:34]Uh, That's the psychology behind it, even though you might have 10, you want to make them feel. I'm working on this today and I'll let you know if I have any questions or if you give them the order, let me know if you need any revisions. I want you to be totally in love with this. It's like, it's all that a little bit of that

[00:24:50] corporate chat has to come out into it and I'm making people feel like they're the most important part of

[00:24:56] Brian: [00:24:56] , So let's shift gears here a little bit now and talk about your podcast.

[00:24:59] You have a podcast called freelance fairytales and it sounds like something that's exactly in line with what our audience is. They're freelancers. They want that fairy tale lifestyle, right? Is that what it is? You know, I don't know. It's, it's a cool name. I like the name. I love a literalism alliteration, literalism, alliteration, whatever, man.

[00:25:16] I like making a board on this podcast. So talk about your podcast and, and what you talk about.

[00:25:20]Alex: [00:25:20] Yeah. So for right now, it's only in season one and it's just me rambling 19 different times, but I go over basically everything a person would need to know, to get started freelancing, to know more about how to do it responsibly, how to make it a full-time gig, how to travel while you do it. How to overcome the imposter syndrome and all the mindset, things that come along with it.

[00:25:41]it's a gold mine of free information. I always tell people when they ask me questions, I'm like, you got to go listen to my podcast. They're only 19 minute episodes and it has everything you could ever need. Next at this fall I would like to do now with season two where I, start to have guests on, but I'm just basically like getting it all out there.

[00:25:58] So people have it. forever in the event. I go ahead And do some other things besides freelance

[00:26:04] Brian: [00:26:04] So that that's not just for freelance writers. So that's for pretty any

[00:26:07] kind of freelance.

[00:26:08]Alex: [00:26:08] yeah, it's for pretty much. I, think there's one episode that's like specifically for writers, the other I

[00:26:15]Brian: [00:26:15] think you were smart. You

[00:26:16] did what, how many was 1920 something episodes as a solo,

[00:26:19] like just, yeah. And then, so we did 150 with just Chris and I, and

[00:26:23] then we just now started branching out to the other guests. So, I mean, joined the guest train so far, because like, it's, it's so fun talking to different people.

[00:26:30] If you talk about getting bored,

[00:26:32] easily, getting guests on is great because you have no idea sometimes what you're going to get. Yeah. So any other resources, like, I, I feel like we've, we've discussed a lot of great, great stuff here. Any resources you want to send people to, or, or have them go sign up somewhere?

[00:26:44] Like, what's your call to action for audio?

[00:26:46]Alex: [00:26:46] Yeah, I have so many resources. It's kind of hard for me to even think that the best ones my free Facebook group is like a family of its own. Everyone in their posts, their services, they asked for feedback critiques. I've seen that Facebook group like make people. Um, So I highly recommend if you're freelancing to join that Freelancing mentorship with Alexandra Fasulo I, obviously, this is a theme of my life.

[00:27:10] I opened it, never thinking it would be a huge thing. So it has a really long, annoying title, but I post about it everyday on my Instagram as well. If you forget that. So basically just follow me on Instagram and Tik TOK and YouTube And everywhere. And that's where it all is. That's where it all goes down.

[00:27:24]Uh, If you look

[00:27:27]Brian: [00:27:27] just up news is

[00:27:28] all of these links will be on our show notes page.

[00:27:31]At six-figure creative.com/whatever number. This

[00:27:34] is, I'll have to go cut that back in and put that in

[00:27:38] there, but yeah, we'll have all the links

[00:27:39] to this.

[00:27:40] Chris: [00:27:40] You know, Alex, it's, it's funny. I think you're in a similar position to Brian and I. in that we built successful businesses and then accidentally became influencers. And we're wrestling with this is a really different thing than running up and running a business. And the, the emotional baggage that

[00:27:59] with that

[00:28:00]you know it's funny, like you go back and forth between imposter syndrome And egotism.

[00:28:04] At least I do really like, I don't know, I don't know, like I'm not good enough. Oh my gosh.

[00:28:09] I'm so good enough. I'm amazing. And trying to land at a healthy in-between,

[00:28:14]really challenging.

[00:28:15]Alex: [00:28:15] Yeah.

[00:28:16]I, I feel like that's where I see for women. I feel like women's struggle more with the imposter syndrome than they do eco-tourism side of it. Just biologically. So I see women get more caught up in there. Self doubt. And then I'll come across a lot of men who are caught up in their ego And both are detrimental to success in business, but it's funny Cause I can see that's where women men are very different in business from the people I've worked with how women will just, automatically doubt themselves right out, of the

[00:28:47]Chris: [00:28:47] Well, which isn't surprising in the society we're in. They've been taught to doubt them.

[00:28:52]Alex: [00:28:52] right. And exactly, you know, It's funny because I never used to think that sexism existed. I was like, I wake up, I do my thing, whatever who cares. And um, I just get absolutely dragged through the mud on social media for being a woman, doing what I'm doing. So I've become more passionate about it now, you know, like the comments that I get are just. I just look at that. And I'm like, we're the same. We belong in caves, honestly, as a society, everyone just go back to their cave. If this is how you're going to behave, like we might have nice planes and cars, but everyone's still just I

[00:29:26]Chris: [00:29:26] totally agree. I'm fond of saying our planet is a hillbilly paradise speckled with modern societies. It's like 99.9%.

[00:29:37] Alex: [00:29:37] it's just like, I read these comments and I'm like, Okay. Wow. I actually thought more it

[00:29:43] depends YouTube

[00:29:45] Brian: [00:29:45] on what cesspool you're in comments and Facebook ad

[00:29:49] comments are probably the two

[00:29:51] blackest holes of, of SAS in the world. But I wanna, I wanna ask you a question, Alex, far as women, you say

[00:29:56] that they struggle with self-doubt imposter syndrome. How have you personally dealt

[00:30:00] with that and, and gotten past that as an artist?

[00:30:03]Alex: [00:30:03] I struggled with it too. You know, I, when I was first starting out, I had constantly in the back of my head, like, oh, you're scamming people. Cause you're not really a professional you're brand new you're brand new whatever. But I think the two things that I did to overcome that as I charged really cheap rates.

[00:30:17] So at the end of the day, I charged $15. Like. Obviously, I'm not an expert if I'm charging $15. so I didn't feel like I was scamming people by charging such cheap rates. and then the other way to overcome anything is to just do it because then when you're, when you survive on the

[00:30:32] other side, you, you get more confidence. So I would just keep going and, you know, and And each day when I'd wake up and still be alive and a client would still leave a five-star review. Right. Okay. you know, it was just time. It's just time and experience. I don't think you can like snap the imposter syndrome out of your head today. I think you just have to do it. You have to fail. You have to succeed. You have to something that

[00:30:56] Brian: [00:30:56] you said earlier in this interview I, wanna kind of bring back and that was, you were talking about social media and you were saying, people look at what I'm doing now, and they see all the stuff that I'm doing and they

[00:31:05] just feel like they can't keep up with it. And then you said, but I was making six figures with no social media

[00:31:09] presence and whatever, the reason I bring this back up is because so often.

[00:31:14]We as entrepreneurs are not even just living humans, we compare someone's level 62, our level one, we look at somebody who is so like way further in their career than us and see all the things that they're doing, the systems they put in the place, the team they have in place, the income they're making.

[00:31:30] Then they compare that to where we are as absolute beginners. Instead of comparing Alex, Fasulo the beginner making like 30

[00:31:38] grand on Fiverr or the first. of where she was then with no social media with no, this, no, that,

[00:31:44] and I feel like if we're trying to get those baby steps, those baby wins to build the

[00:31:48] self-confidence to get past her own

[00:31:49] imposter syndrome.

[00:31:50] We

[00:31:50] can't look at someone who's that

[00:31:52] far into their career making $378,000 a year on

[00:31:55] Fiverr and branching out on his other entrepreneurial endeavors

[00:31:59]and say, this is what I have to be. No, you just think what's the next step that I have to take today. To get past that

[00:32:05] fear. And as long

[00:32:06] as I take that next step,

[00:32:08] I'm pushing forward to be like Alex, eventually way down the road.

[00:32:12] Once, you know, I've gained traction on Fiverr and made

[00:32:14] millions of dollars.

[00:32:15]Alex: [00:32:15] Yeah. I mean, that's, that's all that it is. And people I think will get really caught up in we're very impatient with things and they want to have everything that I have tomorrow. And I'm like this, is almost seven year journey now where you guys are catching me, but it's tough because they're so new to my social media, I think.

[00:32:32]They think, oh, this just happened this year, which is why I frequently posts like I'm in my seventh year right now, everyone, you know this, this did not happen by accident or by luck. This was working really

[00:32:45]Brian: [00:32:45] six years before I had my first six-figure year. That's like, that's how many years I put in before I broke six figures and that's, but that's why we would do what we do. That's why you have your, your a podcast. Now you have. of course now I believe. And that's why we have our podcast and coach, and that's why we do all we do is, but to help people speed that process up. and and, and one of your biggest hit pieces is by somebody who's salty about you, selling courses. Now it's like, she's, I'm like, okay guys, I, I understand the argument there. I understand the, The hatred for that because there's so many people on the internet. Riding Lamborghinis and like slinging their income around and holding up cash.

[00:33:22] And they put a really bad taste in the mouth of people who are. trying to educate on business, but we're trying to do things differently. We're trying to be a little more approachable, a little more relatable, a little more realistic in what we're doing and give people a realistic picture of what it is to be a freelancer. and we're trying to help speed up the process. We're not trying to scam you so we can buy a damn Lamborghini. So that's kind of my little soap box there on the subject. And I don't know why I brought it up, But I was just this. I'm just, it's there It's in my head. It's in my head, my heart, and I want to

[00:33:46] talk.

[00:33:47]Chris: [00:33:47] Well, and let me.

[00:33:48] hop in there. I think that

[00:33:49] Brian, what you've experienced and Alex, what you've experienced, and I need me to a considerably

[00:33:55] lesser degree for some reason, but I think

[00:33:57] when, when somebody expands, what other people see

[00:34:01] as possible that they're going to get pushback. When you start to say,

[00:34:06] look, your future could look like this worst case scenario or best case scenario.

[00:34:11]It's 10 times better than you hope it could. That's scary for a lot Of people.

[00:34:15] Cause it changes. it's a bracketing issue. And when you expand the bracket, that much, it's

[00:34:21] terrifying. it's terrifying too, to suddenly be like oh wait, I thought I was getting a

[00:34:27] B it turns out like I'm actually a pretty

[00:34:30] small fish. the pond is a lot bigger than I thought it was. So I think particularly as a woman, That what

[00:34:36] you're doing freaks the hell out of a lot of men

[00:34:38] that, it's like, oh, this 25 year old girl is so much more of a bad-ass I am now. I don't feel like a man. So I will alleviate that by commenting. And that's.

[00:34:48] Do you find that most of

[00:34:49] your haters are men or is it women or are balanced?

[00:34:52]Alex: [00:34:52] Oh, I'd say it's 98% men. It's um, some psych studies honestly could be done in my comment sections. I think there's something that could be deduced from it I don't know

[00:35:06] Brian: [00:35:06] Our audience is like 97% men. putting you listen. I would, as if I see a single damn comment

[00:35:13] people you're banned from her.

[00:35:15] Chris: [00:35:15] We will unsubscribe

[00:35:16] you somehow we will design technology that will

[00:35:18] Brian: [00:35:18] a

[00:35:19] Chris: [00:35:19] you from, from listening.

[00:35:19]Yeah. I'm Alex on behalf of men. I am so

[00:35:23] sorry. We're awful.

[00:35:26]Alex: [00:35:26] I just like, I don't know what has happened, you know, with guys our age or whatever. Like, I don't know what, what is so wrong, but there's, so these guys are so insecure. It's such an insecure generation of men that I'm just like

[00:35:41] why are you even worried about what I'm doing over here? Like, shouldn't you be doing thing and I'm doing my why

[00:35:49]Chris: [00:35:49] Wouldn't

[00:35:49] Brian: [00:35:49] thing

[00:35:50] Chris: [00:35:50] money by working instead

[00:35:51] trolling.

[00:35:52]Alex: [00:35:52] Exactly. and it's like, I don't get on there and posts like I am a feminist or anything. I don't do I'm none of my stuff is like gendered at all. I just get on there and I'm like, Hey everyone, you can make money online, have a good day. And then I get off. And it just, my most recent viral video is like the most.

[00:36:10]Innocent educational video. I'm just like, hi guys, I'm Alex. And I'm a ghost writer and here's what I do for a living. And it's the most, you know, not intense video ever. and it's actually the most hate I've ever gotten on a video. It's unbelievable. And I'm like, there should be some study done on there's something about me.

[00:36:28]That is so triggering. and I don't know what it is because I'm just me. I, if you guys met me in person, I'm like small too. I'm like five foot three. I have like red hair. I wear weird earrings.

[00:36:40]I

[00:36:41]Brian: [00:36:41] can't speak for those people but I can just

[00:36:43] say that I'm in the similar boat. 99% of my haters are men. So I know how you feel out. I'm joking. I have no idea how you feel, but, but I have a similar

[00:36:52] thing. And all I can say is I just try to stay as far away from those humans as

[00:36:55] possible.

[00:36:55] Because generally when I find a hater, it's somebody who is unhappy with their own circumstance, hurt people, hurt people. That's what the saying is if someone's hurt, they're going to go hurt others. That's the same with bullies. That's the same with online bullies, offline bullies, whatever you want to call it.

[00:37:06] So I, I don't know if we're going to change humanity, but I definitely don't want our listeners to fall into that trap because the second You start

[00:37:11] worrying about anyone else than your own race, like staying in your own lane And doing your own thing

[00:37:16] and stop looking left and looking. Right. Even though I, looked right when I said.

[00:37:20]But no one's watching the video. So, this is okay. I can do that

[00:37:23] and not be made fun of when you start, when you start looking to these other people,

[00:37:26]You're going to have a much easier time not having a comparison syndrome, but also not judging other people while you're on this race.

[00:37:32] Like Alex took time out of her day or morning

[00:37:35] to come to this podcast and share with us some of her journey.

[00:37:38] And she's been vulnerable with

[00:37:40] us.

[00:37:40]Some people, if this had millions of views

[00:37:42] or downloads, which it won't most likely I don't, you know, our podcast, I know what kind of our numbers right now, unless this somehow goes

[00:37:47] viral, you know, one hour podcast, which rarely happens. But I'm just

[00:37:50] saying if it happens people will find something to hate about this.

[00:37:53] And that's the sad

[00:37:54] thing don't fully understand it,

[00:37:55] but I just want people to know that you should not be

[00:37:57] part of this sort of,

[00:37:58]Chris: [00:37:58] Well, and that brings up a story from from high

[00:38:00] school for me. So I was obsessed with tracking

[00:38:03] can field And cross country in high school. it

[00:38:05] was my favorite thing and I probably wouldn't have graduated with that.

[00:38:09]My coaches, well, some of my coaches were great. One of them turned out to be, he's in federal prison.

[00:38:15] Now that's

[00:38:16] another story. But one things that I had, this one particular coach poach fully, that was awesome. And, you know, as a freshmen or sophomore, you know, I ran the eight hundreds, two laps, and you know, you're basically trying to break two minutes. That's like the big benchmark and what you do, you see freshmen and sophomores do is when they're running, they keep looking keen behind them.

[00:38:34]If there's anyone behind them, especially on the last, you know, 150 meters of the race, they keep looking behind them to see if anyone's going to catch them, because it would embarrass them and never forget. Coach Foley sat me down and he saw me doing this as like a freshman. He's like, when you turn your

[00:38:48] head, it slows you down.

[00:38:51]It messes with your biomechanics and your time in that race will now be worse because you looked backwards. And what was great about that? I never looked backwards ever again, and it was so nice to just keep my head moving forward. And

[00:39:03] Alex, my hope and my wish for you is like you are on

[00:39:08] a rocket ship right now.

[00:39:10]You're kicking so much

[00:39:12] ass

[00:39:13] and your mission is stay healthy. If you just do that, If you just

[00:39:19]Keep yourself in a sustainable way where you

[00:39:21] don't let people get in your head where you don't look

[00:39:23] backwards and you just look forward. You're going to

[00:39:25] be just fine

[00:39:27]Alex: [00:39:27] think this is

[00:39:28] Chris: [00:39:28] yeah, I really true.

[00:39:30] I think that if you get

[00:39:31] consumed with what haters are saying, that it's going to slow you

[00:39:34] down. .

[00:39:35] Brian: [00:39:35] so let's, let's wrap things up here, Alex, cause I it's top of hour. I want to respect your time and I wanna make sure,

[00:39:40] like you can go fulfill the work that you got to do, that you get paid tons of money to do

[00:39:44] and, and, and go across the world and continue that rocket ship.

[00:39:46] So I just want to say as a wrapping things up. here, first of all thank you for coming on the podcast. Thank you for sharing with us and make sure if you're listening to this podcast, you go listen to the freelance fairytales

[00:39:56] podcast as well.

[00:39:58]Alex: [00:39:58] Thanks guys. Yeah, no, definitely go listen. And Chris, thank you For that, those words.

[00:40:03] All we'll

[00:40:04] Chris: [00:40:04] warm

[00:40:06] Brian: [00:40:06] So that is it for our interview with Alex . Chris, how do you feel about the interview? Do you think it went well? Do you

[00:40:11] Chris: [00:40:11] I loved. Oh, my gosh. She was so ridiculously cool. And so put together and I kept thinking of this phrase that like grownups would use. And I was a kid, man. Her head is just screwed on tight.

[00:40:25] Brian: [00:40:25] Like I love when he tried to do the Southern accent, because as someone who grew up in Alabama truly Southern family, you do, you do not get it right?

[00:40:34] Chris: [00:40:34] it's a caricature, a caricature it's, it's a skill. And we're going to, yeah, she was amazing. And to me, like, as we were talking and I was like, This woman is going to crush over the course of the next 10 years. I don't, I think her current success won't even register compared to what she's going to do in the future.

[00:40:51] Like she's she is There are not like her.

[00:40:55] Brian: [00:40:55] So the people that didn't hear this, but we talked a lot about tech talk after the interview was over. And, uh, that seems to be one of her big areas of, um, of dominance on the internet as far as social media. So I'd like to get her back on just to talk about that stuff, because area that we need to explore as a six-figure creative, because it's just such a, I see my wife on there.

[00:41:13] She, she made it to photographers to videos. I like 20,000 views, but just like nothing on Tik TOK. In the grand scheme of things. I mean, but for a person who's never put a video out on Tik TOK and to get that kind of traction and thousands of followers within two videos, like that's crazy to me to see that kind of traction with, with, with that world.

[00:41:29] But, back to what we talked about in the podcast, because that's the stuff that matters for our listeners. I don't know if I'm quite convinced that Fiverr is off my list as far as like the place for creatives to go. Like, I don't feel like I'm fully convinced there. She makes one good argument. Creatives when they're first starting out, they don't know what marketing, if you need to get that first win and just get the feeling that you can be paid by a stranger like Chris Graham.

[00:41:53] I think your first payment was via a check because you're that old. Yep. Your first internet

[00:41:58] Chris: [00:41:58] Well, the client that

[00:41:59] Yep

[00:42:01] Brian: [00:42:01] bit of both. Cause it was a long time ago. You got your from a stranger the

[00:42:04] Chris: [00:42:04] on yeah, this is like, oh, seven.

[00:42:05] Brian: [00:42:05] Yeah, but okay. But, but going back to this, like, if you need that, like that first you need that validation that you can do this and people will pay you for it.

[00:42:12] And they will like it. Like Fiverr could be maybe a good place to start, but I just

[00:42:18] I would want to build my career on that.

[00:42:20] Chris: [00:42:20] let me hop in here because I, I think an interesting point. As we did her interview, I'm beginning to Mo to grasp a little bit more, more thoroughly that I think the most important moment in an entrepreneur's life is when a complete stranger hires them. I think it's when that happens, that there's the potential free for you to understand that the market is so much bigger than you could ever possibly imagine.

[00:42:44] Brian: [00:42:44] That is like so many freelancers in creative, start out by friends or family.

[00:42:48] Chris: [00:42:48] just friends and family, that's not entrepreneurs. Selling to your friends and family is not entrepreneurship. It's practice for entrepreneurship. It's a scrimmage. You are, you are not actually doing the real thing. And once you go out and get those first couple of people that hire you that are complete strangers, that's where the self-confidence starts to happen.

[00:43:08] And what Alex talked about, about how she did all these small projects and got five star reviews for them that, that killed her imposter syndrome. It ha I didn't, you know, didn't pipe up and say this, but that reminded me of. When I, I didn't have a ton of imposter syndrome because I'm, uh, I'm a weirdo. Um, there's, you know, neurological issues there for sure.

[00:43:30] But Once you collect a bunch of reviews from a bunch of small projects and you have something to point to, and you can say, Hey, look, we've got 55 star reviews on Google or Yelp or whatever it happens to be.

[00:43:40] That's a game changer. And I think that for a lot of people, not for everybody, but I think for a lot of people, that's a great first step. What is the easiest shortest path to you working with strangers and making into collect reviews

[00:43:55] Brian: [00:43:55] Yeah, it's just another element of social proof. Talk about social proof. Again, I'm not going to go into the details about what that is, but essentially when you see a long line, a restaurant versus a restaurant with no one in it, you're going to go to the all things being equal.

[00:44:07] You're going to go to the restaurant with the long line, because you say, if it's good enough for those people, it's good enough for me, the reviews. Is there a way of saying that it's a way of like building trust in that, in that stuff. And I, and I can tell you right now, Alex is likely going to have more credibility in her writing business, just because she's been featured on Forbes, on business

[00:44:22] Chris: [00:44:22] cider on

[00:44:24] Brian: [00:44:24] And I would, we didn't get into this. I wish I would have actually. I would imagine she's getting clients off of Fiverr now in a, in a, probably a pretty high amount of those off of Fiverr, because she has her own personal brand. She has her own website for her stuff, and she's able to get leads and customers off of Fiverr.

[00:44:42] And that's kind of the evolution that I'd want to save for anyone who's looking to get started on Fiverr or who anyone. Who's what I consider stuck on Fiverr. maybe start looking for how can we start marketing our business on our own? Because we can't keep paying out 20% of our business to Fiverr for the rest of our lives.

[00:44:57] Like that's that to me is too big of a hit to take, for the benefit of Fiverr sending you clients. Because as long as you're on their platform, you have to bend to their rules. You have to give into, if you are no longer favored in the algorithm, your income could drop overnight.

[00:45:14] Chris: [00:45:14] Well, and I totally agreed. Having one place where getting all your customers, that's scary, but it's scary. Not because of the current reality. It's scary because somebody else could change the rules.

[00:45:27] Brian: [00:45:27] And it's not just this, it's not just Fiverr, by the way. It could be, if all your leads and customers are off of one social media

[00:45:33] one

[00:45:34] Chris: [00:45:34] be if your entire business is on eBay.

[00:45:36] Brian: [00:45:36] Yeah, that's true. Or if you get all your clients from Tik TOK, or you get all your clients from Facebook ads, or, you know, it insert one thing, just it's called a single point of failure.

[00:45:45] If you have all your clients from Fiverr, that's the single point of failure. If Fiverr bands your account, because you try to pull a client off of its platform and that's against the terms service you're out. Now, you don't have any clients now because you had that single point of failure, which failed.

[00:45:59] And so that's the whole point is like, I don't have, you know, there's. Issues with Fiverr. It's literally got cheap in its name. It's called Fiverr. It originally started because everything on that website was for five bucks. So even launching Fiverr pro, I don't know how they're going to get away from the whole cheap feeling because

[00:46:14] Chris: [00:46:14] Yeah

[00:46:14] got a branding issue for

[00:46:15] Brian: [00:46:15] They've got a branding issue, but all that being, you know, take, take away the cheap side of things. Like, just want to say, like, I, I'm not fully convinced, but the, again, the numbers, the numbers speak for themselves.

[00:46:26] Chris: [00:46:26] Yeah.

[00:46:27] Brian: [00:46:27] That that's an area I can't forever hate because I know you can build a six figure creative business on it because Alex let do it

[00:46:33] Chris: [00:46:33] Yeah. Well, and I think if I were starting from scratch to go back and pull up your initial question about if you were going to start from scratch, would Alex have still done Fiverr? And she said yes. As I listened to Alex's story, I think before our interview with Alex, I would have said, no, I wouldn't have started on Fiverr, but now.

[00:46:52] I'm not so sure that in her argument was so great about, well, the first time you start to take strangers money, that creates a unique opportunity in interests. So to go back to my running illustration, I got into track because we would run the mile once a year in gym class and it turned out I was pretty good at it.

[00:47:09] And I liked

[00:47:10] Brian: [00:47:10] you doing it back before he actually did track. How fast you were running? A mile

[00:47:13] Chris: [00:47:13] Um, in seventh grade I ran it in five 50.

[00:47:16] Brian: [00:47:16] did six 50.

[00:47:18] Chris: [00:47:18] No. My best in high school was 4 37, but I only ran the mile. A couple of times I was more of an 800 guy ran a 1 58, 8 was the best I ever did. And in the 800, I loved it. But most fun I had in track pole vaulting

[00:47:32]Brian: [00:47:32] We've talked about this on the podcast. You're the only pole vaulter. I know you're also the only bee farmer I've ever met. were the only coffee roaster I met until I started doing it. So a weirdo. It's fine. It's

[00:47:45] Chris: [00:47:45] fine it's fine

[00:47:46] Brian: [00:47:46] Yeah. So I think this is a good place to, uh, to end this. Or did you have more to that story, Chris?

[00:47:50] twisting your mustache, which means your thing.

[00:47:52] Chris: [00:47:52] no, it means that means I just like to pet my mustache. It's like my pet right now. going to get a cat and a puppy at some point in the very near future. In the meantime, I just have a mustache.

[00:48:02] Brian: [00:48:02] Okay. Well, that's a way to this episode. Thanks listening this podcast. We have a lot more cool stuff planned for this. So stay tuned for future episodes every Tuesday morning, bright and early at 6:00 AM. Thanks for listening. Oh, I don't do the happy hustling anymore. Happy hustling.

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